X-COM/XSDF RP THINK TANK (part3)

Alzdude28

Alzdude28

Active Member
DarkGemini24601 said:
...really Alz? No, really? I have been so beaten over the head with issues that DONT CONCERN ME that I hardly think you can say I'm ignorant. Fuck, that's rude. And don't bother apologizing for ressurecting the topic because that doesn't excuse you lighting a fire under my ass ONE BIT.

There is no dsicrimination against LGBT in the XSDF or any military in Vanguard of Forseti. That is my lore. And there won't be any visible in X2 because we'll be too busy fighting to save our world to be prejudiced.

I don't want those sort of social politics in a story I'm leading because quite frankly it ruins mu enjoyment. Not because I have something against LGBT people, but because I want to write stories about people struggling through combat and such.

I don't want to tell stories about "oh the poor minorities". That's nonfiction, and it doesn't bring me any enjoyment to see. i wpuldnt have fun writing a discriminated against character, nor would I enjoy playing as the discirminator.
Click to expand...
Gem, first of all I don't think you're ignorant, I'm just saying that you probably don't understand the significance of the fact that there is no discrimination. It's something that you have to experience. My personal life is a mess because I have to force myself to stay largely closeted, because I know that the majority of people will not accept me in the same way. The idea of a world where I can really be who I want is incredibly appealing to me, and I love the fact that we've created that in the story. My point is that we shouldn't flat out ignore humanity's success in overcoming this prejudice.
Second, just because it doesn't concern you, doesn't mean it doesn't concern anyone, and there's more to life than combat. While this is a war story, it's important to remember that soldiers are people. They all have lives that are affected by "social politics", regardless of their fight. I, personally, think that a war story that dehumanises the characters is, at best boring, and at worst downright offensive.
Finally, you also say that you don't want stories about "the poor minorities". So therefore can I assume that every character has to be a two-dimensional white, male, cis, straight American or Western European? Without minorities you have a huge number of potential plot that you can't use. Its not a question of "non-fiction" is a question of the way society is. You just can't write a believable story without a good basis and, what is for our characters, history is hugely influential in the way people interact. Just because these issues no longer exist, doesn't mean that they no longer have significance.

You say that you don't want to write about these issues. I'm not saying you have to. I'm saying allow other people to, themselves. I presume you believe in freedom of thought.
 
MarineAvenger

MarineAvenger

Operator 21O
Staff member
Alzdude28 said:
Gem, first of all I don't think you're ignorant, I'm just saying that you probably don't understand the significance of the fact that there is no discrimination. It's something that you have to experience. My personal life is a mess because I have to force myself to stay largely closeted, because I know that the majority of people will not accept me in the same way. The idea of a world where I can really be who I want is incredibly appealing to me, and I love the fact that we've created that in the story. My point is that we shouldn't flat out ignore humanity's success in overcoming this prejudice.
Second, just because it doesn't concern you, doesn't mean it doesn't concern anyone, and there's more to life than combat. While this is a war story, it's important to remember that soldiers are people. They all have lives that are affected by "social politics", regardless of their fight. I, personally, think that a war story that dehumanises the characters is, at best boring, and at worst downright offensive.
Finally, you also say that you don't want stories about "the poor minorities". So therefore can I assume that every character has to be a two-dimensional white, male, cis, straight American or Western European? Without minorities you have a huge number of potential plot that you can't use. Its not a question of "non-fiction" is a question of the way society is. You just can't write a believable story without a good basis and, what is for our characters, history is hugely influential in the way people interact. Just because these issues no longer exist, doesn't mean that they no longer have significance.

You say that you don't want to write about these issues. I'm not saying you have to. I'm saying allow other people to, themselves. I presume you believe in freedom of thought.
Click to expand...
There is freedom of thought, but in this story cannon, the issue is resolved. Simple as that, no changing it.
 
DarkGemini24601

DarkGemini24601

Well-Known Member
Alzdude28 said:
Gem, first of all I don't think you're ignorant, I'm just saying that you probably don't understand the significance of the fact that there is no discrimination. It's something that you have to experience. My personal life is a mess because I have to force myself to stay largely closeted, because I know that the majority of people will not accept me in the same way. The idea of a world where I can really be who I want is incredibly appealing to me, and I love the fact that we've created that in the story. My point is that we shouldn't flat out ignore humanity's success in overcoming this prejudice.
Second, just because it doesn't concern you, doesn't mean it doesn't concern anyone, and there's more to life than combat. While this is a war story, it's important to remember that soldiers are people. They all have lives that are affected by "social politics", regardless of their fight. I, personally, think that a war story that dehumanises the characters is, at best boring, and at worst downright offensive.
Finally, you also say that you don't want stories about "the poor minorities". So therefore can I assume that every character has to be a two-dimensional white, male, cis, straight American or Western European? Without minorities you have a huge number of potential plot that you can't use. Its not a question of "non-fiction" is a question of the way society is. You just can't write a believable story without a good basis and, what is for our characters, history is hugely influential in the way people interact. Just because these issues no longer exist, doesn't mean that they no longer have significance.

You say that you don't want to write about these issues. I'm not saying you have to. I'm saying allow other people to, themselves. I presume you believe in freedom of thought.
Click to expand...
1. Alz, to the best of my knowledge western society is rather accepting of alternative sexualities these days. Anyone that would actively hate you is a radical idiot, and anyone that disagrees politely shouldn't be a concern.

2. I'm not arguing for a blanket sweeping away of social issues, I'm just being realistic in the context of the story. In this 2044 someone who is cruelly predjucied against other races or sexualities would be a rare abberation.

3. you misunderstood me, unreasonably so. I have played an Inuit woman, a Russian man, a family of bisexual clones, and so on just in Story of Defiance, and my characters are no leds varied racially in this story.

I an saying XCOM stories here should never be about victimhood. The focus of the story should not be blurred by signifigant discrimination. If one guy like ramma's Billy Campbell is a bit xenophobic, so be it. But there should not be systematic oppression or discrimination, because that's not remotely relevant to the story.

If, say, we had James Delanor castrated like the guy you mentioned, that would be horribly out of place and wouldnt be enjoyable for Frost nor the rest of us. It would just be inapropperiate, needlessly dark, and politically charged.
 
DarkGemini24601

DarkGemini24601

Well-Known Member
MarineAvenger said:
There is freedom of thought, but in this story cannon, the issue is resolved. Simple as that, no changing it.
Click to expand...
And the reason I say people shoudlnt bring it up much is because its no longer relevant. And most characters can't even say "you remember the gay rights movement?" Because it was before their time. It was complete in the west by 2019ish, and spread to the rest of the world a few years later. Most 20-30 year olds people were toddlers or young kids when it was concluded.
 
Alzdude28

Alzdude28

Active Member
First of all, I feel I should apologise. Much of what I said wasn't thought out, and may have seemed unnecessarily aggravating. It's been a long week, and you touched on a sensitive topic, I can't really justify lashing out. I misinterpreted some of what was said, although I do still feel that my point about past issues having a larger effect is still valid. Sorry if I caused any offence.
 
DarkGemini24601

DarkGemini24601

Well-Known Member
Alzdude28 said:
First of all, I feel I should apologise. Much of what I said wasn't thought out, and may have seemed unnecessarily aggravating. It's been a long week, and you touched on a sensitive topic, I can't really justify lashing out. I misinterpreted some of what was said, although I do still feel that my point about past issues having a larger effect is still valid. Sorry if I caused any offence.
Click to expand...
Yeah, and trust me, there might be a bit more relevance in X2, but not in the way you'd expect. Not from XCOM though. The Commander isn't intolerant, and besides... While the ChristopherOdd seasons made it cool, potraying XCOM as nefarious always made me queasy. If the staff and heads of the organization defending humanity are bad news, then who can we depend on?
 
DarkGemini24601

DarkGemini24601

Well-Known Member
Adrammalech said:
Undertale, anyone?
Click to expand...
7e6.png
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top